Daniel Amos Message Board | Print: The Passion Of The Christ

Posted by zippetydoodaddy on 02-26-2004 at11:59:

RE: An important distinction

quote:

Originally posted by DwDunphy
Jesus mumbles and dies and, three days later, he exits the tomb with baskets of Reeses Peanut Butter Cups and Marshmallow Peeps.

DwD

That was so freakin funny!!!

I heard Dennis Prager say this morning that Jews see a different movie than Christians based on their life experience. Jews will see Jews killing Jesus and Christians will see Jesus dying for their sins. There's no way of justifying the two, but for the Grace that is greater.

zip

Posted by jiminy on 02-26-2004 at12:16:

Tangents-

listened to this in the a.m.-
it feels appropriate here ;

Insult Like the Truth
Written by Charlie Peacock & Douglas Kaine McKelvey

I've run my ship aground
on the rocks of the soul
There's no lie like independence
there's no demon like control

I've fanned the burning embers
til my house was on fire
There's no parody like power
There's no fever like desire

I've drained the wine of darkness
to the dregs of deceit
There's no drug as strong as pride
There's no blindness like conceit

I've railed against the mountain
With a pickaxe and a file
There's no minefield like presumption
There's no death wish like denial

Chorus:
There's no gunshot like conviction
There's no conscience bulletproof
There's no strength like utter weakness
There's no insult like the truth

I've adjusted my prescription
til I couldn't trust my vision
there's no killer like convenience
there's no sickness like omission

I've amended resolutions
and resisted explanation
There's no trap door like emotion
There's no pit like reputation

Chorus:
There's no gunshot like conviction
There's no conscience bulletproof
There's no strength like utter weakness
There's no insult like the truth

bridge-
There's no cancer like ambition
There's no cure like crucifixion

Chorus:
There's no gunshot like conviction
There's no conscience bulletproof
There's no strength like utter weakness
There's no insult like the truth

Posted by Lur King on 02-26-2004 at15:44:

RE: An important distinction

quote:

Originally posted by DwDunphy
Now, in our enlightened modern mindset, we see Jesus getting laid out in a holy headlock by Roman centurians, and his inert body is strapped to a cross, all clean and neat. Jesus mumbles and dies and, three days later, he exits the tomb with baskets of Reeses Peanut Butter Cups and Marshmallow Peeps.
DwD

good writing...

I have seen this played out in countless Easter dramas...
minus the Marshmallow Peeps...

Posted by jiminy on 02-26-2004 at16:06:

agree DW and dale-
well put!

wished I culd right like dat.....

Posted by Scrimshaw Nick on 02-27-2004 at08:10:

I saw The Passion on Wednesday and will agree that it is a must see. I cannot get it out of my head, nor the lyrics to The Twist. I will probably see it again in its run here.

Oh, and I was quoted on the front page of the impressive Indiana Gazette. Although, I was quoted as my secret alter ego . . . not as Scrimshaw Nick.

In the words of Art Carney, "Very interesting . . . "

---------------------------
Desire your own pith helmet on the Message Board

Posted by jeffrey k. on 02-27-2004 at22:30:

So my wife and I saw the movie this afternoon....and while I found it moving and perhaps the best movie ever made on the subject, neither my wife or I left with that sense of "quiet" or whatever you want to call it that so many people seem to report leaving with.

Just being honest here, but I really don't think the movie went far enough. Basically you watch for 2 hours as the brutality of the crucifixion unfolds, only to have literally 5 seconds of the resurrection and then the credits roll? Come on! Lets see the rest! It was a let down in that sense.

I've never doubted the brutality of what Jesus endured for me, so in many ways watching it didn't "shock" me, in fact I've always imagined what he endured was far worse....what moved me more were the all too brief scenes of him as a young boy and as a young man teasing with his mother Mary. It put a terribly human face on our Messiah, one that really lived as a little boy, skinned his knees, played in the dirt, made furniture as a young carpenter, teased with his mom, etc. That stuff really got to me.

All in all, it IS well done, but I really wish it went further.

My real prayer for this movie is that I hope our Christian cluture can fight the temptation to merchandise, capitalize, musically tributize with your "favorite" CCM artists, and study guide this movie into yet another product or trinket for us to consume, use as a tool for lazy evangelism, and then forget.

Love to you all...

jeffrey k.

Posted by DwDunphy on 02-27-2004 at23:43:

We agree

I hope the movie starts conversations and exchange of ideas, not WWJD wristbands and Prayer of Jabez guidebooks...

I think, however, that after this week, the movie will quickly and conveniently disappear. Having looked down the tunnel of humankind's most crucial moment, my cynical side still says most will not go in, and will most likely run like hell for safe places...

I mean, that's why Jesus was crucified in the first place, wasn't it?
DwD

Posted by audiori on 02-28-2004 at00:35:

We saw it today and I think it's an excellent reminder
of the horror Jesus endurred. I think it's good to not
nice that up. It's important people see what he went through
for our sins. If he can endure that for us, we should at the
very least be able to watch a reinactment, don't ya think?

I think, just like in the film, the real scarey thing is that
people try to discredit. They attack and try to tear down the
film for any and all reasons, technicalities, slight liberties
with combining certain characters, etc.
I've seen people, Christians rip up the film... that seems counter-
productive to what good the film can accomplish. Which makes
you think...who would want to do that? Maybe that
bug nosed freak carrying bald hanker we saw wandering
through the film.

I was a little put off, or I had this weird feeling of irreverence
with people munching swiss vanilla booboo and popcorn while watching
Jesus die. That seemed strange to me.
Although about halfway into it our packed theater became dead
silent, and stayed that way the rest of the film.

Posted by Mark on 02-28-2004 at08:59:

I still haven't seen it. If I don't make it this weekend, then I will go Tuesday since I have the day off.

Posted by DwDunphy on 02-28-2004 at09:47:

Tearing it down...

Well, the fullness of the criticism has been nasty and underhanded. I recall the Diane Sawyer interview with Gibson when the subject came around to his father who is apparently quite an extremist, and I'll leave it at that. Perhaps the underlying thought was to ask if that extremism informed the movie... Maybe.

But Sawyer phrased the questions in such a way that it was like she was condemning his dad and wanted Gibson to turn on him, comment on his politics and, perhaps, "save himself".

Gibson replied,"You gotta back off my father, Diane. We're tight". He was obviously upset by A) the intrusion into his family life B) the notion she wanted to expose him as an extremist "nut" C) the focus forceably being shifted from the content of the movie to the content of the Gibson family history.

And now, Mel's portrayed as equally bristling because he defended his dad, right or wrong, because it's his dad for cryin' out loud.

I thought that was rude and endemic of a society that is comfortable with dishonoring their own AND with betraying them to cover their own skin...

Like the movie or hate the movie, it is drawing real life parallels just by its very existence.
DwD

Posted by jeffrey k. on 02-28-2004 at12:33:

quote:

Originally posted by audiori
I think, just like in the film, the real scarey thing is that
people try to discredit. They attack and try to tear down the
film for any and all reasons, technicalities, slight liberties
with combining certain characters, etc.
I've seen people, Christians rip up the film... that seems counter-
productive to what good the film can accomplish. Which makes
you think...who would want to do that? Maybe that
bug nosed freak carrying bald hanker we saw wandering
through the film.

I trust you are able to discern from what I posted I am not trying to "discredit, attack, tear down, or rip up" the film. As I said above, I think it is perhaps the best film that has been made on the subject, I just wish that the resurrection had been given more than the literal flash it received. I was disappointed....and because as a believer my hope lies with the RISEN Saviour, for myself it seemed a bit like watching only part of the story.

I also think the way people experience the movie has a lot to do with the crowd they see it with. I have several friends that saw the movie with their church groups, and they report almost "big tent revival" sort of conviction.....where as my wife and I made a point of not attending with a church group or Christian friends in an effort to have some "privacy" while viewing it. We went to an afternoon showing that had everything from college age kids to a group of 15 elderly all in wheelchairs. People talked, munched snacks, 2 babies on opposite ends of the theater cried off and on the whole time, cell phones rang, and several of the old people discussed the movie as it rolled. As we left I overheard people making dinner plans, kids talked about school, a couple girls discussed if they were going to drink that night..... So not the solemn faces and hushed tears many people have reported seeing leaving the theater. Different crowd I guess.

As for what the film can and will accomplish in the face of fair and unfair criticism, I wouldn't worry about it too much. It will land where it's supposed too....

jeffrey k.

Posted by audiori on 02-28-2004 at14:18:

Yeah we were in no means talking about the posts here.

More about some of the general criticisms of society. Even
some from believers.

In the movie satan starts out by trying to put little doubts
in Jesus mind... "who is your father?" ..."No man can bare all the
sins of the world"... "it can't be done" , etc.

The pharasee do the same little snide remarks... "Isn't your father
a carpenter?" ...etc.

The taunts of the crowd were similar, some were outrageous claims
against him, some were snide comments, some were trying
to twist his words, some tried to question his accuracy,
questioning his reasons for saying certain things, etc...

Those were all things to undermind what he was accomplishing.

A lot of people put the movie down with little snide remarks,
outrageous claims and accusations against Gibson, questioning
the accuracy, questioning Gibson's motives...

Those are all things to undermind what this film is portraying,
which is what Jesus was accomplishing.

I see a parallel.

I saw some inaccuracies as well, but I think it was an excellent film.
They don't distract from what this film is portraying. I am mainly
talking about people that don't like the film or seem like they don't.

Posted by Col Parker on 02-29-2004 at00:09:

I'm surprised that no one has commented on why Mel Gibson has made this movie. His focus was the Passion of Christ. Gibson's intent was not to make a comprehensive film of Jesus' life. Moreover, at least one of the flashback scenes were filmed after the film was originally completed.

Are there any Catholics on this board? Catholics are familiar with the 14 Stations of the Cross, which Catholics are encouraged to meditate on each Friday during Lent.

This film is the perfect meditation/substitute for the Stations of the Cross.

This film has driven me to one place, to the cross. It reminds me of why I became a Christian, and how little progress I have made. I have taken the gift of salvation way too lightly.

Mel Gibson's film has not entertained me. It has haunted me. It has forced me to reconsider how serious I am in my faith. Didn't Jesus say we should pick up our cross daily? This film forces me to deal with my daily sacrficie. And if I truly love Christ, I should love others as he loved me.

I will thank God for Mel Gibson tomorrow at Mass. How many of us are willing to lay it on the line the way Mel Gibson did in this film?

Posted by jiminy on 02-29-2004 at00:21:

Hi jim
Glad you liked it -
I am thinking aboout seeing it soon.

Posted by Mark on 02-29-2004 at08:37:

quote:

Originally posted by Col Parker
I'm surprised that no one has commented on why Mel Gibson has made this movie. His focus was the Passion of Christ. Gibson's intent was not to make a comprehensive film of Jesus' life. Moreover, at least one of the flashback scenes were filmed after the film was originally completed.

Are there any Catholics on this board? Catholics are familiar with the 14 Stations of the Cross, which Catholics are encouraged to meditate on each Friday during Lent.

This film is the perfect meditation/substitute for the Stations of the Cross.

This film has driven me to one place, to the cross. It reminds me of why I became a Christian, and how little progress I have made. I have taken the gift of salvation way too lightly.

Mel Gibson's film has not entertained me. It has haunted me. It has forced me to reconsider how serious I am in my faith. Didn't Jesus say we should pick up our cross daily? This film forces me to deal with my daily sacrficie. And if I truly love Christ, I should love others as he loved me.

I will thank God for Mel Gibson tomorrow at Mass. How many of us are willing to lay it on the line the way Mel Gibson did in this film?

I am a Catholic and yes you are correct. The movie is the stations of the cross. I haven't seen it but I have been telling people that at work. I'm probably going to see it Tuesday morning.

Posted by Skemankis on 02-29-2004 at08:52:

My wife and I saw the movie last night, and the thing that kept going through my mind was that He did this for me! I've been in church all my life, so going in to the movie I was thinking, I know this story, I won't be very surprised. On one hand I was right. I wasn't surprised. I was , however, absolutley stunned. The film didn't even do it justice, as horrible and realistic as it was. And the fact that He did it willingly and never once complained is so amazing. I think the movie is a wonderful telling of the death of Jesus, I just wish that it would have gone farther into the resurrection because that's the best part for me as a Christian.

I think that a lot of the criticism of the film is based on this: when Jesus is portrayed accurately, whether in His death, His life or even His birth, unbelievers get offended because it's a lot harder to defend their ways in light of the Truth. And when it is presented in such a powerful and moving way as it is in The Passion, (not to mention by one of their "own" megastars) it shakes them to the core. That's just my opinion.

Posted by Joey T. on 02-29-2004 at11:17:

i might see it today......

Posted by audiori on 02-29-2004 at12:54:

The seventh definition of Passion in Random House
Dictionary is; The sufferings of Christ on the cross or His
sufferings subsequent to the last supper.

This movie is about Christ's sufferings, thats the goal of this film.
I think it does an exceptional portrayal of Christ's suffering for the sins
of the World.

All of God's rath toward sin, was poored down on Christ as a
substitute for us.

The small reasons people have to criticize the film do not in any
way take away from that. Those things are unimportant to what Christ
did, just like it was unimportant who Jesus' earthly father was.

The film cannot be perfect technically because it is not the Bible,
it is a translation of that one section of the Gospel. Some of the
liberties Mel Gibson took, such as combining certain characters
into one person I think were done so the audience would not be
confused or distracted by who is who. And keep their minds on the
goal of the film.

Posted by Space Ghost on 02-29-2004 at15:42:

We (myself, my wife, and our two kids) returned home not too long ago from seeing 'The Passion'. A very moving experience for all, to be sure. I have a tendency to apply song lyrics to life as it goes along (call it a sort of internal soundtrack playing perpetually) and over the past few days before going to see it, I kept thinking of line from The Choir song 'Circle Slide' that says...

Around my neck I wear a wooden cross
And sometimes I remember what freedom cost

I think that line was also what I had in mind in taking my kids to see it, as well. My son turns 12 next month, my daughter's 10 1/2. I certainly think each parent should determine in their own heart if their kids are ready for something like this...and both my wife and I felt the answer was 'Yes.' And we're glad we did. I wanted them to get an image of what freedom cost.

Then during the crucifixtion scene, I couldn't help but hear Johnny Cash's song 'Redemption' play internally...and it's still resonating within...

From the hands it came down
From the side it came down
From the feet it came down
And ran to the ground
Between heaven and hell
A teardrop fell In the deep crimson dew
The tree of life grew

And the blood gave life
To the branches of the tree
And the blood was the price
That set the captives free
And the numbers that came
Through the fire and the flood
Clung to the tree
And were redeemed by the blood

From the tree streamed a light
That started the fight
'Round the tree grew a vine
On whose fruit I could dine
My old friend Lucifer came
Fought to keep me in chains
But I saw through the tricks
Of six-sixty-six

And the blood gave life
To the branches of the tree
And the blood was the price
That set the captives free
And the numbers that came
Through the fire and the flood
Clung to the tree
And were redeemed by the blood

From his hands it came down
From his side it came down
From his feet it came down
And ran to the ground
And a small inner voice
Said "You do have a choice."
The vine engrafted me
And I clung to the tree

SG