 In response to Jevon and the "Real Label" question...  |
jeffrey k. 
Luteous Llama
Registration Date: 06-28-2002
Posts: 386
Location: downers grove illinois
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| In response to Jevon and the "Real Label" question... |
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Jevon The Tall said:
"This is exciting news, and at the same time somewhat sad too. Good that there's another album, and sad that it's on such a small market label. No offense intended at all to lo-fi - very good releases with quality product. It's just so small, with limited distribution. Which makes me wonder if the boys have tapped the vein and there's no real label interest for them."
I figured I'd "move" this down here so the news could be the news and we could further discuss this angle of it all.
To begin, no offense taken. I do my best with the releases and whatever happends.....happends. In all reality, if you look at the history of the Dogs, the closest they have come to a "real" label has been BEC and they really didn't seem to do all that much with them. The truth is, in todays market very little of this has to do with the size of the label or wether or not it has distribution anymore, instead more and more it has everything to do with wether or not the fans will actually buy the releases if they have an outlet to go and get them.
From what I have been told the Lost Dogs sold many many more records in the early and mid 90's than they do now....so where did all those people go? (And I am talking a few thousand record...sorry...CD buyers...) They can't all have just stopped listening to music. Where did they go? This is something I've actually talked to Mike and Terry about and the consensus seemed to be that sadly most of these folks must have just "moved on." They got married, had kids, bought homes, have car/house/student loan payments.....and CD's aren't really a priority anymore. This stuff has nothing to do with label size or wether or not your local bible bookstore or best buy is stocking one copy (in the wrong section) with a cracked case.
Then there is this....I talk to people who tell me they "love the Lost Dogs" but then they haven't bought anything since Little Red Riding Hood or Green Room Serenade Part 2. I've run into this sort of thing more times than I care to count. Some of these people are friends of mine. I've personally just decided that their idea of "loving" a band must just be very different than mine and must be very different from a lot of the people on these message boards cause a lot of you kind folks buy everything.
I think Jevon has it right in the sense of maybe showing people you know the DVD, or playing a Dogs CD for your friends....but maybe in addition to that also telling people you know that already like the band that the CD is coming out and where you can get it. (and really, I don't care if it's from me or the band...just so they get it!) Maybe bring a friend to a show in your town if they are coming to your town. Truth is, most of you already probably do this stuff...and if not, it really does help. Word of mouth is a big thing.
At the same time, I'm excited about this album and am (on very short notice...) putting together some promotion that will hopefully give it some legs and get it some notice. Lets see what we can do.
Anyway, good discussion. My best to you all.
jeffrey k.
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"Life handed us a paycheck, we said 'we worked harder than this!'" - Modest Mouse
This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by jeffrey k.: 06-05-2004 22:48.
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06-05-2004 20:10 |
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jeffrey k.
Luteous Llama
Registration Date: 06-28-2002
Posts: 386
Location: downers grove illinois
Thread Starter 
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I always fear that when I write these big posts that I come off heavy handed. I truly don't mean to. To make matters worse yesterday I had a migrane that lasted from 1pm until 5am this morning. It was so bad last night that I actually considered going to the emergency room....so I'm kinda fuzzy today....my migrane medication sorta has that effect on me.
Anyhoo....I really am excited about the Dogs record. Small label or not this is gonna be great and lets all see how much we can support the guys.
jeffrey k.
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"Life handed us a paycheck, we said 'we worked harder than this!'" - Modest Mouse
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06-05-2004 20:29 |
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dorfsmith
Grand Encephalon
Registration Date: 03-24-2002
Posts: 28,142
Location: Everybody needs a persicom
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Jeffery,
The small labels do more for true art than any big label could. You are my hero 
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06-06-2004 00:15 |
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Jevon the Tall
Woolly Eggwhisk
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
Posts: 943
Location: "You're not from around here are you?" said the stranger to the little man in the wool sweater who looked vaguely like a sheep. Maybe it was the long boots but he was kind of cute. "What's your name?" he asked "My friends call me Theo." he replied
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I didn't read that as heavy handed at all, and I'm so glad you caught the tone of my post, and your response was PERFECT.
I agree that BEC didn't get them over to the next level, but they had enough distribution that I saw copies in the virgin megastore in Vancouver.
But it is perplexing, especially to us who love music, and follow artists for life it seems, how people can fall off the wagon and move on. Like truly, "Where did they go?"
The other day at work me and some chums were chatting about music, and artists we admire, and I was tasked with listing some current music I really like. So I listed a bunch of examples, and I got blank stares. What they mean was new bands, or at the very least bands they've heard of.
Small market artists, and label specially geared to service them have been proven to make money, and actually funnel more money back to the artists than many majors who tend to ignore or drop the non selling bands.
So Jeffrey, when I bemoan the fact the dogs have worked out an indie deal, it's only that I wish they were being courted by Capitol and getting production advice from George Martin.
For you personally this must feel like a huge validation of your fledgling label, and I applaud you. I will be early in line to support the release, and will feature them on my little page of hubris (I predict that it won't suck - how's that for going out on a ledge?), and do the stuff I can. Will it help sales - you never know? Will it hurt? Never.
Am I a fan.
Yes, yes I am.
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06-06-2004 00:15 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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It's really a weird thing trying to find the missing fans...
There does seem to be a bunch that are "still fans" - at least, they claim to still be fans - but they don't bother buying CDs or going to shows. We know some folks like that in the St Louis area. We've also talked to a lot of people on the internet that claim to still be fans of DA/77s/Dogs, yet they haven't purchased a DA/77s/Dogs CD since the late 80's or early 90's or something. I don't know what they're waiting on.
I can remember the 77s coming up on one of the music newsgroups not long ago.. a bunch of people said they were fans, but they hadn't listened to them
in years because they don't do the "old '88 style" any more. It's like they expect them to stick in that time period and never change.
Although, we have noticed that with each project that gets released - we gain a bunch of new names in our address list. We generally add a dozen or so new names every week. The DA list alone is probably 5 or 6 times the size it was when we started. I guess that means that many of the old fans are slowly coming back.
Promoting concerts, requesting their songs on internet or regular radio stations, playing them on your own shows or writing reviews, playing songs for friends, etc... it all can help a lot in bringing people back. All it takes is
for an old fan to stumble on a review that sounds interesting enough to check it out.
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"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-06-2004 00:40 |
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Squidzit
Platyhelminth
Registration Date: 05-14-2003
Posts: 6,235
Location: Be the change you wish to see in the world
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The fans that don't buy the music are still fans, just not "HARD CORE SUPPORTING FANS" like most of us here. I buy every cd these bands come out with, I tell people about them (both in person and on the internet), I direct people to their web site and I lend out my cds to whomever wants to listen. I just always wish I could do more and get more people to listen to these guys. For the longest time I thought Driver, Blackhat and me were the only DA fans in the world. Then I came here and found a bunch of nuts with a passion for this music just like me. 
As far as the new Lost Dogs album, I have only one question...
...why no "William"? 
I love that song.
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"Why a four year old child could understand this...
run out and get me a four year old child, I can't make heads or tails of it."
~Groucho~
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06-06-2004 19:16 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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We also have on occassion, an old fan who writes us who seems to have no idea the last 15 years have happened at all. They say something like "the last album I bought was Vox Humana... and I had no idea these guys were still around."
Not sure what happens unless they just are not 'internet' people until now. It used to be that you had magazines such as NoteBoard, Harvest Rock Syndicate, and even CCM who would do big articles on these bands... then the last 15 years, you would be lucky to see them mentioned. So much so that their fans like me quit buying CCM and the other two don't even exist.
If you were not on the web, where else would you hear about them?
It also maybe that their kids are now getting old enough, that they are turning back to their interests?
Not sure.
__________________
"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-06-2004 19:32 |
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Mark
Moderator
Registration Date: 03-18-2002
Posts: 9,525
Location: Grand Encephalon - Words have their place but live what you say God can have His way when you hit them with Love
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| quote: |
Originally posted by audiori
Not sure what happens unless they just are not 'internet' people until
now. It used to be that you had magazines such as NoteBoard,
Harvest Rock Syndicate, and even CCM who would do big articles
on these bands... then the last 15 years, you would be lucky to
see them mentioned. So much so that their fans like me quit buying
CCM and the other two don't even exist.
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Bingo!
They have no market. They don't fit into or get play in the secular world and the CCM world doesn't know them anymore either.
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But never, never pin your whole faith on any human being: not if he is the best and wisest in the whole world. - C.S. Lewis
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06-06-2004 20:39 |
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bereal
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 03-08-2004
Posts: 11,824
Location: "I still love Jesus, I'm just afraid of His followers." DwDunphy
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That is just so sad! We must continue getting the word out about all these great bands! I told my friend we were driving 4 hours to go see The Lost Dogs, and 2 sentences later, she asked me, "Who's The Licked Dog?" Shameful! Utterly shameful!
And I can't seem to get anyone interested in their music. I don't understand why, 'cept for they jest wanna listen to that popular crap that is marketed as music. Some of those old fans just may have children who are listening to that stuff, so they are too. They must've forgotten what good music is, kinda like someone who loses their job and has to eat ramen noodles forgets what good food really tastes like, until they actually get to eat good food again.
We must give them a taste of good music again! MF and I are doing all we can. We give CDs for birthdays, Father's Day, Christmas, etc. to try to get people in our family interested. Guess it's just a frustration we all deal with.
BTW, MF's brother-in-law actually liked some of the music when he gave him 3 CDs for his birthday. He actually thanked us for them. 
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Lay your crushing hand, Your mighty hand, On me gently
Your crushing hand, Your mighty hand, On me gently
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06-06-2004 21:41 |
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sprinklerhead
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 12-11-2003
Posts: 1,290
Location: Austin, TX
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| quote: |
Originally posted by bereal
That is just so sad! We must continue getting the word out about all these great bands! |
This is exactly what I did when I found out about the BBQ tour. I knew that most people around here did not know who they were. A BBQ party at our house was a great way to introduce them to the music. Many bought CD's and told us they really enjoyed them. One couple said they expect us to do that annually. If my wallet would allow it, I would.
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I had another dream about lions at the door
They weren't half as frightening as they were before
But I'm thinking about eternity
And I'm wondering where the lions are...
I'm wondering where the lions are...
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06-07-2004 08:42 |
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DaLe
Official Impasto
Registration Date: 03-19-2002
Posts: 2,717
Location: MiNNeSoTa - HeRe we put salt on the Roads... Lord, Help me be Salt of the Earth - NoT Salt in the Wound. so, take most everything I SaY HeRe with a grain of Salt !
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| quote: |
Originally posted by audiori
We also have on occassion, an old fan who writes us who seems
to have no idea the last 15 years have happened at all......
Not sure what happens unless they just are not 'internet' people until
now.....
If you were not on the web, where else would you hear about them?
...Not sure. |
I ran into an old friend camping this weekend.
( I had not seen him or talked to him for about 7yrs.)
he was a music bud of mine in the mid-late 80's
Stryper, Bloodgood, Adam again, DA, 77s etc....
he had no idea Gene Eugene had died, no idea DA had a "new" cd out.
no idea the Lost dogs were still around no idea that Rez Band
had any 80s era music on CD...
so I informed him and am sending him a few links on the WWW.
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06-07-2004 12:46 |
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ProdigalDog
Unsullied Affiche
Registration Date: 05-20-2003
Posts: 26
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Another 'problem' with exposure for the Lost Dogs and DA is they do not get any radio time. I listen to a few Christian radio stations in my area regularly and have never heard a Lost Dogs or DA song. When Nazarene Crying Towel came out I sent requests and emails to these stations and didn't even get a nod. I don't know if this problem is because of the label they are on or what. But when my church sends our teen group to concerts and such it is Jars of Clay, Caemdon's Call and bands like that. These bands get alot of radio time and exposure and the younger generation of Christians knows who they are and are familiar with their music. I have sent a general invitation to my congregation to attend the July 7 Lost Dogs concert and have gotten no responses. The truth is that nobody knows who they are.
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06-07-2004 13:33 |
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larryl
Official Impasto
Registration Date: 08-25-2003
Posts: 3,554
Location: if you see me, tell me, so i will know where i am
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i am one of those who drifted away, and am now playing catch up.......
and i have two close friends who haven't bought anything in years....one has moved on to other music, the other thinks nothing can ever compare to the "good ol days".....
and one of them actually intro'ed me to the 7's, by leaving his "88" cassette in my car!
anyway....i just got caught up in other things for a few years, and drifted back, more through the board than anything....
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Ecclesiastes 1
1 The words of the Teacher, son of David, king in Jerusalem:
2 "Meaningless! Meaningless!" says the Teacher. "Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless."
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06-07-2004 13:40 |
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sprinklerhead
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 12-11-2003
Posts: 1,290
Location: Austin, TX
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It seems like they need someone to market them. It would have to be someone that knows what they are doing though. They are not an easy band to market because they do not fit nicely into one genre. I believe that is what appeals to most of us. To push a band, a marketer wants a rock band, a country band, a blues band, etc. Not one band that drifts in and out of many different styles.
Here is what we should do. We have people in many different states and a few countries here. We form a promotions company stating that we have offices in all these locations so that we sound large. Then we print up some promotional material and spread the word anywhere that we can.
OK, maybe that is just a crazy dream. Sounds like fun though.
I'd really like to see their audience grow. I'm just not sure what how to go about doing that.
__________________
I had another dream about lions at the door
They weren't half as frightening as they were before
But I'm thinking about eternity
And I'm wondering where the lions are...
I'm wondering where the lions are...
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06-07-2004 13:59 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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Not a bad idea really.. a Dogs/DA/77s "street team." A group of
folks around the world that would be willing to push them in radio,
in magazines, with concert promoters, music stores and hunting down
those "missing fans" that have lost touch... We'd certainly help by
providing promotional material whenever possible (bios, pics, CDs
to radio stations, etc)
Anyone out there not already overworked?
__________________
"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-07-2004 15:00 |
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Eleanor
Platyhelminth
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
Posts: 5,111
Location: NFP
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| quote: |
Originally posted by audiori
Anyone out there not already overworked? |
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06-07-2004 15:10 |
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sprinklerhead
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 12-11-2003
Posts: 1,290
Location: Austin, TX
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| quote: |
Originally posted by audiori
Not a bad idea really.. a Dogs/DA/77s "street team." A group of
folks around the world that would be willing to push them in radio,
in magazines, with concert promoters, music stores and hunting down
those "missing fans" that have lost touch... We'd certainly help by
providing promotional material whenever possible (bios, pics, CDs
to radio stations, etc)
Anyone out there not already overworked? |
I talked to KGSR Austin awhile ago. They were looking for requests of bands that had not been played much on the radio. I misunderstood and found out that they wanted stuff that had been in their play list before. Anyway, when I described the Dogs to them, they thought it sounded right for the station. If you want to send me some promo stuff, I'll try again with them.
It is a pretty good station and you can listen live from the website.
__________________
I had another dream about lions at the door
They weren't half as frightening as they were before
But I'm thinking about eternity
And I'm wondering where the lions are...
I'm wondering where the lions are...
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06-07-2004 15:27 |
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Captain Pedantic
Official Impasto
Registration Date: 12-18-2002
Posts: 2,686
Location: "This calls for a very special blend of psychology and extreme violence." - Vyvian - The Young Ones
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Well I'm willing to help as far as I can in New Zealand.
The BEC disks made it into the local bookstores!!! but nothing else.
Let me know what to say to them and I'll contact the local distributors and also the Rhema Broadcasting Group the runs the Christian TV channel and two Christian Radio stations (One is aimed at youth and one at 30-50 year olds - or as I say it one wakes you up and one puts you to sleep)
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06-07-2004 16:17 |
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dorfsmith
Grand Encephalon
Registration Date: 03-24-2002
Posts: 28,142
Location: Everybody needs a persicom
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I have been in contact with my local radio station a lot recently. I'm going to seriously push The Lost Dogs and DA as much as possible. They play a lot of independant bands in the styles of The Dogs and recent DA
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06-07-2004 16:50 |
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Tweed And Smoke
Dark Steamy Cabbage
Registration Date: 06-18-2003
Posts: 11
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I'll be at the July 7 concert and am really looking forward to it. Of course, i'm one of those who already buys everything they do, not a new convert. Cool to know you're the pastor of the church. I'll say hello at the show.
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06-07-2004 17:25 |
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